Additions - Tumblr Posts

Honestly, even when I still have my own criticisms with how she was handled and how some things could have been improved, I agree fully! Strikers even kinda calls out the, "tear it all down" mentality with Akane to an extent which I thought was good! It's not trying to give an "OMG ACAB" message. It's more nuanced than that.

But really though, great take!

Aight so this may be my hottest take to date but having seen the discourse around Makoto on this site it must be said: People accusing Makoto and the entirety of P5 of bootlicking are fucking idiots.

Now, while IRL I'm under no illusion of the heroic 'good cop' that means to cure the corruption of the police force from the inside (given that most either quit or die doing so), P5 makes a very concerted effort to show on a more fantastical scale that it's not the individual that needs changing but the system.

Kamashida, Kaneshiro, Shido, by Qlipoth World they're among the rest of the disillusioned masses who in all facets of society, the police, education, crime and politics, turn a blind eye in apathy. That's why the final boss of vanilla P5 isn't Shido, the one corrupt individual who we'd all like to think is the source of all wrongs in society, but Yaldabaoth, the embodiment of the system that perpetuates it.

After the defeat of Yaldabaoth begins what we and the Thieves hope is a new day, with the metaverse gone the Thieves must now act to change the system through their actions in the real world, and this idea is furthered by the adult confidants of the game. Adults, who at the beginning of the game are all viewed by the player and the Thieves with animosity, who we see through confidants like Tora and Kawakami, are trying to change the system.

Makoto becoming a police officer is not only reinforced by her history with her father but as exemplified by Sae becoming a defence attorney is a statement that the system CAN change, not that we should seek to tear it all down but to make changes through policy both personal and political to do so. Almost as though that's the only things are gonna get better in real life.

An addition since I realized something: It was left ambiguous on when she's talking more as Sumire as opposed to "Kasumi", but I can't help but feel like her false awakening was more Sumire showing up as opposed to her false identity.

As in her constant feelings of worthlessness and self-hatred slipping through the cracks but also her being just as kind as her sister. Her, "I am..." moment kinda adds to that due to the hesitation in her tone and struggling with saying her "name."

There's also her suddenly experiencing headaches when seeing a cognition of herself which gets killed... Almost like both her real self and fake self are warring with each other in her mind and cognition.

So I feel like "Sumire" did win out for a brief moment but reverted back to "Kasumi" due to the filter which would explain Cendrillon popping up albeit slightly reluctant/scolding. At least that's my interpretation if that makes sense.

Ok I need to get this ramble off my chest before I forget: I feel like people completely misunderstand Sumi's motivation and breaking point for her first/false awakening. Why? Well let's dive in!

I've seen people complain about it and how seems like it's all about losing her scholarship but dialogue after that awakening actually painted a different picture. I can see WHY it seemed that way but then this part happened:

She WAS upset about it but even she admitted that the school wasn't exactly wrong in this (As assholish as the VP was, he wasn't entirely wrong either sadly).

Instead, contrary to popular belief, she was more upset that she caused trouble for and dragged Maruki into this mess to begin with.

Not only that but she overheard the vice principal basically insulting her behind her back:

Now keep in mind he had a point and didn't know she was in earshot but still it was completely out of line for him to even say that, about a student who already lost her twin not too long ago no less.

On top of that not only did she feel horrible for Maruki but she also horrible for even Joker getting dragged into her mess...

She felt useless and a huge burden to everyone. A failure... Even to her deceased twin sister. Now regardless of which sister died, it had to be a massive blow to her mentally. Especially when you consider that Shujin might have aware of who she really is but still said all those things and did all this to her... Now with Sumi's overall mental state combined with the filter occasionally slipping... Little wonder she finally snapped during that awakening. It's even showcased after it too:

So while the dialogue leading up to her awakening can seem like it's all about the scholarship and losing her special treatment, it really wasn't. She really didn't care about the treatment at all as she had said previously, it's just that she feels that she's hurting and letting people like Maruki, Joker, and her sister down.

Hell, even this dialogue is less about the scholarship too! It's mostly about she's been treated and how much the school is pressuring her and how it's effecting her loved ones and it's valid! Fuck Shujin!

Now the only downside is that she's awakening as a fake, a fraud, not Sumire Yoshizawa but Kasumi Yoshizawa and that was the biggest thing she was missing hence Cendrillon's words during that one:

"So adamant... Rather than accept a life in cinders... You'd strive towards splendor-- you know the risk... Well, if those really are the shoes you've chosen... Then we'll dance to the end. Iam thou, thou art I... Accept this contract... The spell cast upon you."

Regardless though, to boot: She wasn't actually being "whiny," she was just being empathetic and felt worse about herself and this was when she was being Kasumi! It later perfectly ties into her dynamic with Maruki and why she felt empathy towards him after regaining her true self as Sumire!

She had been in his shoes and understands! She's a strong girl! She had FUCKING EMPATHY!! And that's even when she was being someone else. Her awakening as Kasumi wasn't about a dumb scholarship, it was more about her feeling like she's a burden and letting people down... Especially those she cares about like her sister, Dr. Maruki, and Joker to name examples!

Holy shit Windows Photos/Photo editor has some really cool filters! (1st image is the original screencap I took)

Same as before, 1st image is original screencap I took.

Assorted Sumi screenshots I took for a Twitter meme before settling on the 4th one. Slightly edited to enhance the colors too!

Also a bonus one that I did while fiddling with filters which accidentally made her look like Kasumi a bit.

I was suddenly thinking about this and I can't help but want to put in inspiration from Revolutionary Girl Utena (namely Utena's "Adolescence of Utena" design). Kinda as a double reference to that anime and the prince from the ballet combined with Odile.

Namely the shorts and top style and turning Sumi's shoes into tall boots. The coat is gonna have the tails but maybe altered a bit.

...God I really need to watch this anime. But yeah, what do you all think??

So I have been struggling with my own Odile Sumi redesign and this is what I came up with so far using her concept art as a chart of some sort. Like parts of her canon design is fine actually (the coat is to die for!) and it can actually still fit the theme I'm going for but idk. I'm still thinking about it.

Full notes to help:

-White in lining and underside of coat (inspired by the P5 Manga Vol. 11 cover)

-White ruffles and either black or white gloves (the latter because, I still like the potential symbolism) [fixed errors]

-Shoes either stay black or changed to red.

-End of coat tails inspired by Ella

-Replace with tights.

-Black feathery skirt

-Definitely a haircut like my own edit/HC. New ribbon? Unsure.

-White border on the mask (also inspired by P5 Manga cover)

Further notes not pictured:

-The possible red shoes idea was recycled from an idea I had for a redesign I did a while back. It would have been a reference to the film, "The Red Shoes."

-The symbolism thing I think about with the gloves: So... I very briefly mused about it a long while back but I can't help but feel like her having red gloves can not only be her whole thing with Joker but also symbolic of her subconsciously thinking she still has "Kasumi's blood" on her hands since during her boss fight, she outright feels like she "killed" her sister and would rather run away from the truth of it all. Her gloves changing could be symbolic of her acceptance of it, that it wasn't really her fault. White or black is what I'm still deciding on since both could coordinate well but I'm also tired of the small amount of gatekeeping with the idea of, "gloves = elemental affinity" thing. Overanalyzing? Yes, but still would have been neat!

-I'm not SUPER confident in it but I want to attempt it too so... I just want to make her look different, but I worry about it still feeling like a Joker knock-off. I had more majorly different design ideas, but they didn't click oddly. Also small confession: Her, Joker, and Zenkichi (and my PT Maruki to an extent) being coat tail besties is becoming my lifeblood! Still feedback would be nice if you so desire!

Bigger version of the manga cover (I know it's probably the lighting but I love how there's a border on her mask and how there appears to be white on the inside and lining her jacket a bit):

And yes, the coat tail idea was loosely inspired by Valjean's design but probably different. Sumi and Zenkichi bonding make my brain go brrrr!

Omg all of this is so good!! Making the canon 2nd tier into the 3rd tier is a really cool idea! In my case of making her new Persona Odile, I was considering that it would maybe be named after one of the ballerinas that performed in Swan Lake as both characters, Pierina Legnani. Especially since Legnani apparently previously performed in Cinderella so it would be a nice bit of irony. Though that's mostly due to Ann's 3rd tier being named after someone who performed in "Carmen." But honestly, your ideas work just as well!! That reminds me, I should rewrite "A New Pair of Shoes..." someday.

IN THE CASE OF CENDRILLON.

I think I won't be the first to say that Cendrillon is not the ideal primal Persona for Sumire. And I mean exactly Sumire after her true awakening post-rank 5.

Yet, Cendrillon is perfect for the Kasumi. The awakening was painless without blood, shot by shot, copying the magical girl's transformation. And she had no problems accepting her Persona, proudly shouting her name to the unknown danger. You couldn't find the more ideal folktale heroine for a character like that.

In addition, Cinderella is known for her hard work something that Kasumi has been putting on in her gymnastics, keeping her positivity and smile. And we have Maruki as the fairy godmother that can make Cinderella's wishes come true. Besides that, Kasumi is the type of girl that easily appease a crowd, or in her case, The Prince.

Now, for Sumire. The game's explanation for Cendrillon is that the true reality for Sumire is essentially living in the cinders; when she was nothing but a servant at her own house. And... That's it? While I am sorry, I haven't played Royal yet by myself, I tried to find as much about Sumire and I saw a lot of people having problems with Cendrillon not changing to a different Persona.

The idea of her sister becoming a Persona (a thing that you could witness in the Megami Ibunroku Persona - and honestly, the whole third semester is the plot of P1) - just, doesn't add a lot to Sumire.

I like Vanadis for her design and idea that fits to demons and mythological figures.

Ella doesn't add anything special as well. People interpret it as a new and happy beginning, but having Persona be basically a bride? It feels very surface level. No offence to Shigenori Soejima (artist and designer for P5) you made a cool design. I just have several questions to a person that is very keen on creating waifus for the sake of waifus.

THAT'S WHERE I END I PRELUDE AND MOVE TO THE IDEA OF THIS POST:

I found an interesting comment on YouTube about "a Tumblr post that talks about Odette being the better Persona for Sumire" <- Which I reblogged just earlier. It wasn't the size I was expecting. … But still, upon hearing that idea, I went:

HELL YES THAT'S COOL!!!

But, instead of Odette, I think Odile is our ideal TRICKSTER Persona.

Okay, so, hear me out:

Odette and Odile in the original ballet were played by the same ballerina because Odile was the daughter of the bad guy, and he turned her to look like Odette to fool the prince and yada-yada.

BUT!!! Odile is like a dark side of the same character that wants to be her perfect self - Odette - but fails, which could only be fixed by "the magic" or in our case, Maruki's actualization (aka Von Rothbart's magic in original).

YOU KNOW WHAT ELSE IS GREAT? Here is Rothbart description from the wiki:

While Maruki is not so vicious, having the Messiah complex. His ideal reality is based on how HE sees fits. So, people had questions. If someone wants to be famous, but another person's desire contradicts that wish, what will happen?

Maruki can: 1) Erase that desire, 2) Change it, 3) Let that come true if all contradiction are eliminated.

Let's forget for a minute about Odile being Rothbart's daughter. In the scenario of P5R, Maruki would do whatever in his power to make that girl wish come true.

WHICH WHAT HAPPENS. MARUKI MAKES SUMIRE'S WISH COME TRUE BY TURNING HER INTO ODETTE. LIKE IN THE ORIGINAL.

Now. Imagine, as her fake awakening, Kasumi has Odette. Her perfect, kind, courages self, who is not afraid to speak her mind, has the swan princess. And you know what swans symbolize? The meaning of a swan is grace, beauty, love, trust, and loyalty. Swan symbolism is also linked to inner beauty and self-love.

(Smth that Sumire thinks she lacks)

The swan curse can be interpreted as Maruki's powers over Sumire's memory and conscious. She is a swan while living under Maruki's thumb. But when she remembers - she realizes she is not a white swan, not even a swan, not Princess Odette.

She is Odile. A trickster with changed appearance and behaviour to make her dream come true without grief on her mind. Does it remind you of someone? Someone who has TWO persona and TWO personalities that goes with the outfit? What a great way to help us understand Sumire more by associating with another character! They are not identical, but they both were kinda manipulated into their positions. Why have a boring love triangle when we could have a strong friendship bond between characters that share some unique experience? Like with the Thieves!

[And I just love how it feels like the types of movies that show us the events from the point of view of a "villain". Someone, give me a play where Rothbart is the manipulative parent who uses Odile for his wishes to become a king or smth, like this guy:

Now back to Cendrillon. Leaving her as Sumire's Persona, we still think that Maruki is her fairy godmother, when in actuality Maruki is someone who made her someone completely different to become her perfect self. Like a father that would do anything for his kids' wishes, no matter the cost.

Second and Third Awakenings:

Vanadis fits quite nicely with the Swan Lake theme with her black feathers. Freyja is a goddess associated with love, beauty, fertility, etc.

And for our third awakening, we could have someone like Nina Sayers (?) because I love this description.

"…and put herself through emotional torment to become perfect."

But honestly, idk who could be Sumire's third awakening in this context. Too many ballerinas. Too little knowledge :c

BUT!!! BALLERINA. WHICH IS PERFECT FOR A GYMNAST. IT JUST FITS ON SO MANY LEVELS, ISTG.

tl;dr Basically, I propose for Sumire to have:

Odile (Swan Lake) > Vanadis > A ballerina.

Kasumi as Odette Persona and Sumire with actual Odile Persona. Cendrillon feels surface levelled.

Sidenote: For AkeShuSumi/ShuShumi/AkeSumi shippers. You can have a SWAN, a CROW and a demon with WINGS lolololo

Official birb trio. :p

Holy shit... Someone said it... Someone FINALLY FUCKING SAID IT!!!!

Like... I've gotten so, so damn TIRED of people bringing it up almost every few days or even every month. It just gradually made me not as passionate about Ryuji over time to the point of finding him overrated and I hate that because I legitimately love the character but god damn... I'm already stressed enough because of working during the holidays, I don't need to hear discourse # 1,000,000,000 about that stupid scene. People really fucking need to move on imo. It's bad, I agree, I get it. Can we just talk about something else instead of beating a dead horse?

Before anyone asks, I didn't find it at all funny but the 1st half wasn't exactly bad and I can understand why they got mad at him. I actually thought he was kind of a dick for saying that Ann doesn't look cute when she cries because I remember being made fun of for being emotional/crying to the point where I developed a habit of bottling it up for years, so I fully understood Ann's response. What he said just really pushed my buttons so much regardless of intent. It didn't help that instead of maybe apologizing or a simple, "Crap, bad timing! My bad guys!" he just doubles down and tries to make excuses which made them madder.

Oh and people LOVE to CONVENIENTLY leave that part out because Ryuji would never! They got mad for no reason! Bull! Shit!

That aside it really just should have ended with a hug instead of a beating really since that was still very disproportionate and unnecessary. Or the anime's version of it at least. Or hell if they want to make it comedic, have a chase start as it fades to black with dialogue showcasing them going from mad to just laughing and starting to cheer up, Ryuji included. Easy! Just pretend those ideas happened! Or again the anime since we can pretend that it's an anime cutscene. There! Problem solved; can we talk about something else? Please!

persona 5 hot take but that one scene after Shido's palace is blown WAAY out of proportion by the fandom. its literally just an anime gag, which persona 5 is. its an anime game with anime jokes.

granted its not a particularly funny joke, its not even a joke i particularly think was warranted or funny myself, but the absolute HATRED towards that one scene is SO OVERBLOWN i honestly cant understand it

Oh god reading this is making me appreciate Ella's design more now! Especially when one looks up what white lilies symbolize, which is very prominent in her design (purity/innocence, rebirth/resurrection, hope, often used for sympathy bouquets as well as weddings)!

Her being interpreted as more ghostly as opposed to a bride just feels more fitting! I love it!

Sumire’s Persona is Cendrillon because she was forced to cover herself the ashes of her dead sister’s identity. Her third Teir being Ella means she’s starting to deal with her survival guilt and is finally mourning her sister in a healthier way. Also read her flower crown as funeral lilies for this reason.

MAJOR P5R SPOILERS!!!!

Keep reading

Both of us: She's the definition of stranger danger and is creepier than ALICE from Strikers.

My first impression of Lady Marie in P5T

why is the first villain a egomaniac muppet lady...

Greeeeat she's an evil bridezilla muppet lady...

(After she brainwashes Ryuji) *racks shotgun* HOW DARE THAT BRIDEZILLA MUPPET BITCH PUT A COLLAR AROUND MY SUNSHINE BOYS NECK...only his RenRen is allowed to do that.

Holy cow I'm surprised by the final result tbh! But yeah, I do have an analysis idea still and it's about Kasumi from what we do learn about her, especially OUTSIDE of Sumire's more biased perspective. Like... The more I thought about it, the more I'm thinking that what Sumire expressed as "Kasumi" isn't a reflection of the real one's actual beliefs. It just keeps them both interesting still and especially makes the twist and even reveal of Sumire's hypocrisy on the matter all the more brilliant imo. There's just too many contradictions of what we do see of her is what I'm saying. But that will be elaborated on eventually ok? I'm still very passionate about talking about this.

@rebecca-lotto funniest thing... From what I can gather these were unused but still found in the game's files somehow. 👀

So... P5S AU where everything is the same except Zenkichi's hair turns completely white as a side effect of awakening to Valjean (mix of both the trauma and maybe using Fury?) which can also be a nod to the Les Misérables novel anyone? No joke, Valjean's hair apparently does turn white at one point in the book and it stays that way for the rest of the story (well, grey and then white according to one source).

Oh yes! You're right!!! I like that! I like that!!!

Ok so I was thinking about Maruki getting a new Persona and thanks to research, it is technically possible to have a Persona that can shift between Navi and Combat thanks to Rise's Persona in P4AU:

...Wait a second... Idea forming... What if Maruki can have that ability too?

Ohhh! I just realized something:

Perhaps kinda like Rise, he would use a visor to scan but can then shift to fight mode when needed since he isn't bad combat wise and has some Metaverse knowledge. Perhaps limitations can be applied too for balance. Navi Mode Maruki would also be able to use "Guiding Tendril" (the ability his Will Seed gives) along with some actualization abilities (namely ailments?)! Of course, the ability would have the limitation of being usable for ambush still. Keeps him from being too op.

It would definitely be good symbolism for his pacifism but also fiercely protective. A fighter but also wanting to provide support as well!

Ok so for those that have seen this tag:

Ermmm... My hand slipped...

"Your eyes are as bright and honest as ever..."

This part of "Transformers: The Covenant of Primus" gets me every. Damn! Time!

Optimus... Just realizing that he isn't alone... And feeling despair over Bumblebee being (temporarily) killed... Break my heart why don't you?? 💔😭

Like no, honey... You were never alone! They all love and care about you damn it!

Honestly, I can still see it (even tho I agree the Wiki is a terrible source in hindsight). Like I have a HC that he snapped at her at one point like Sae did with Makoto in base P5 only to immediately regret it. He tried to apologize but she wanted none of it as it just proved her assumptions correct and gave her more reason to hate him. He then starts to distance himself from her further, rationalizing that it's better this way due to his self-loathing.

Like one thing the game does a good job with is that it frames both parties as being in the wrong in their estrangement. That and we, the player, don't really know what happened back then so it could have happened and was one of Zenkichi's many regrets in life. It's overall a failure in communication among other things (Owada's death threat, Zenkichi's own mental health/state, etc.).

Oh daaaaaamn! You're right, I'll have to check that book out! Definitely adds more interesting context to his abilities for sure!

I swear seeing takes that are like, "Maruki only helped Sumi because she looked like Rumi/Rumi 2.0" or, "He kept invalidating her progress because he's a horrible abuser" just leave me with an aneurysm or something... Like have you all looked up the term, "Psychological Projection" and what it entails? Because I feel some of you all need to and come back later 'cause... Fucking hell...

Also I kinda wanna HC him having BPD now:

Articles: https://www.medicalnewstoday.com/articles/projection-in-psychology#mental-health

https://www.medicalnewstoday.com/articles/9670

100% agree really, I hope we get more interactions since she technically got a bit of a glimpse of it in episode 4!

Honestly, my biggest hope for Hazbin Season 2 is more growth on Charlie since the Season 1 finale is fully starting to showcase that. Namely addressing her methods of rehabilitation and occasional toxic positivity. Like I absolutely LOVE how S1 actually gives a good message about the power of empathy and how her own empathy helped others around her! But on the other hand, I feel like there were some negatives with her that seemed to start getting addressed but got pushed to the side or forgotten about (ex: Her having Angel, an addict, play a drug dealer in a play she wrote herself which was cringey all around). I don't blame Viv at all since she apparently wanted more episodes but A24 refused so here's to hoping we get more for Charlie in S2!

Ohhhh Myriddin sounds so cool as a Persona idea for him!!! This whole Palace/Jail idea is so good I'm eating this up like crazy!

Like the poor bot having to confront everything he had hidden and bottled up due to all the trauma and burdens that was placed on him but still wanting to help others even if it means he gets hurt himself or worse.

Sooooo... This has been buzzing in my head for a while when I was planning out my P5 X TF: Prime Crossover AU but... Techno-Organic (Human/Cybertronian hybrid) Joker for this particular AU anyone?

(And yes, it's inspired by Sari Sumdac from Transformers Animated (another fave of mine) tho probably a bit darker in this case)

I would probably say The Hermit since I feel like it fits his overall personality better along with his tendencies to self-isolate as well as his bottled up emotions.

"Abel" won out gang! Kinda surprised really but hey! Funnily enough I had a slow realization that I accidentally made a double reference to "Able" which can also fit his desire to help people because the words sound similar. XD

Oh god... Maruki totally would make a pun when coming up with it with everyone cringing omg! 🤣

I guess my PT Maruki is going through a small rebranding so to speak? Mostly reconsidering his codename. The most I got so far is:

-Abel (Abel in some versions of the Cain and Abel story had him be the first martyr and Mooki kinda has a martyr complex)

-Advisor (since he's getting a Navi mode now)

-Lovecraft (...Self-explanatory)

Eh, poll time I guess? I'm doing one on Twitter too .

Ok I look away for a few minutes and I'm pretty surprised by the responses? I did just stumble upon a fanfic so far and it looks interesting! It's called "Fast Company" by AlastorsToothpick on AO3: https://archiveofourown.org/works/55262818/chapters/140181274

But wow! Can I just say the following:

@top-shelf-tender Your tags I am seriously eating all this up your take on it sounds so good! I'm a huge sucker for this kind of scenario and I can see it! ^_^

Alastor in orange tho... Hmm... Maybe!

But yeah I'll consider this AU for a future project b/c it does sound fun! Till then tho, stay tuned!

You know... I ADORE all the HuskerDust AUs where Husk is still an Overlord who won Angel's soul in a game with Valentino, really they're always so cool!

But I'm surprised that there doesn't seem to be any AUs where Alastor LOST that faithful game instead of Husk back then. Basically Husk ends up winning not only Alastor's own soul (how Idk but maybe his own soul is not owned by somebody in this kind of AU), but ALL of the souls in Alastor's possession at the time (he got cocky and bet them all). So now Alastor is bound to Husk and would act as a means to scope out more souls (husband's idea) as well some form of advisor and muscle along with utilizing his radio show. Maybe even more eventually for any shippers? ;)

Idk but this is a kind of AU has loads of potential!

Baltimore Sunroom Mid-sized medium tone wood floor and brown floor sunroom photo with a standard ceiling