Other People's Words - Tumblr Posts
this august has been dyed in pomegranates. i am plagued by angels. i bake perfect cookies, and the world is ending. i feel lovely, and i am surviving, between sorrow and begging others to vote wisely. i watch good movies on zoom. i am the closest i’ve ever been to learning a new gymnastics trick, and i am aggressively kind. i want to swallow the whole world’s ugly in a reverse pandora’s box; collect all the evil in my vocal chords so when i open my mouth to speak, only hope comes out. i want to be a blueberry in maine. i spread jam and eat ripe fruit and say - if i am here, and alive, let it be in the name of crows. raucous, and unloved, and an omen of death - i spread open my fingers and count all the places you have made me grow callouses.
— ii. stories about a boy (c.w)
The Myths of Dragons
I finally uploaded chapter six of this ever-growing fic! I swear I meant it to be done by now, but it went and grew it’s own plot so now I need to roll with it. Let me know what you think! If you haven’t started it yet, here you are.
Jaskier likes to think of his life beginning at Oxenfurt. It’s easier that way–easier to think he is simply a human bard. He can let the memories of his parents and court and draconic life fade into the past where it belongs. And honestly, was his life really him living before studying music? What’s a bard without a song or a poet without words? Yes, things are simpler this way…most of the time.
aka
5 myths about dragons and 1 truth about witchers
@jaskierswolf
y’all mind if i just go feral for a sec
i saw this absolutely gorgeous post and my brain went buck wild, so have this
It’s early spring. The world is just beginning to thaw, and Jaskier could wax poetic about the buds and blossoms peaking shyly from the branches above for hours. Oh so hesitant to bloom, are they, lest the lingering frost take them in the dead of night. Some of the braver ones bloom early, eager to dazzle their neighbors and boast their colors. Pity the fame is so short lived, as not hours later their petals freeze in the night with the icy kiss of death.
Fools, the whole lot of them. Only the truly patient know of honest and wild beauty.
At least, from Jaskier’s experience, anyway.
Keep reading
CASUAL INTIMACY
Your smile seeking my eyes across a room
As swallows seek the sun of the south in winter.
Your arm around my shoulder as we sit
Close, close, closer,
A familiar weight that coats me in warmth
More than any coat.
You taking away a fallen eyelash from my cheek,
Your fingertip on my skin
A gentle gust of wind in summertime.
My coffee with a cloud of milk
And a slight snowfall of sugar
As if I had made it myself.
Our hands intertwined
As we are, in every gesture,
Every ordinary moment,
Two plants with separate roots
Twisting around each other
And reaching the same sunlight.
Happy holidays, @pxwerpxlitics! I hope you like it.
and i shall be the wolf who dines upon wolves, the sheep upon sheep, the man upon men —
i will be invader, rebel, cannibal, traitor, murderer and thief; i will be rotten flesh and tainted blood, and all things in between.
i will ruin what i cannot have, i will bite the hand that feeds, and i shall suffer none so much as they shall suffer me.
— out of spite // m.a.w
I am too fearsome to be loved, too monstrous to be desired. I am too indifferent to be empathetic, too self-possessed to be vulnerable. I am too skilled at this thing of being alone, of not wanting, not yielding (too intelligent, too demanding, and too resourceful; too full of life to be half-loved...). I would demand from them a great and terrible love equal to mine, which, being balanced people, they could never hope to supply (for what sane person would allow themselves to be consumed like this?).
Do not mistake my meaning, it is not that I am unworthy of them - it is that they are unworthy of me.
They call him Kenobi, the Wizard of the Black Hills.
He is legend come to life, they say. His boots have stirred the dust at the galaxy’s edge, and the stars trail in his wake.
Some say he has lived for countless years in the Black Hills of Tatooine, his life extended by clandestine arts. Others claim they saw him fall from the night sky, an infant in his arms. They say the child is his heir, rescued from wrath and fire, brought to live a humble existence until his birthright is revealed.
A few have seen a cloaked apparition roaming the barren sands when the skies grow dark and shudder with the gods’ displeasure. They say the lightning on these nights springs from the wizard’s very hands, that they’ve watched as he conjured blue flame from the desert air and danced with it, the sky flashing bright around him.
They speak of him when he passes by, trading legend as fact. He has toppled governments, laughed at enemies, counted royalty as friends. Justice is his battle cry and mercy is woven through his very bones.
They say he is the last of an ancient race of mages, magical beings who fought for the oppressed. His wrath is terrible, his compassion unconquerable, his life a conduit for something greater than himself, greater indeed than all the worlds he has left behind.
They call him Kenobi, the Great Wizard of the Hills, the Conqueror of Stars, a friend to the helpless, the bringer of Hope
And he smiles at the name.
The Legend of Kenobi
This was super interesting,and the answers too. The main post deserves an essay which I’m not capable to write,but I wanna do the thought experiment at the end :) On tumblr fans might skew older,so the answers might be very different from the ones you would get on Twitter. For some very young fans,this is the 'BTS canon',and they get very upset when someone insinuates that they might not all live together,for example. But I can't blame BTS for wanting to protect their privacy and not making any statements.
The only one where I would feel upset is if they aren't close. Because then,almost all on-camera interactions we have seen between them are fake? Honestly,if they were able to act so fond of each other so well for 8 years,then they all deserve Oscars not Grammys. I don't think all of them are best friends. But that they get along well with each other,and are a genuine team,even almost family.
I don't believe any of the rest. They might have been starving,but wasn’t that because of brutal kpop diets rather than cheap healthy food not being available to them? I surely hope they didn’t go hungry during their trips,at least. I was actually relieved to see Taehyung use his own card to pay for food once in BV1. I don't think them starving brings any prestige to anyone,and it would make me hate Hybe to hear they only get to eat what they win during games.
Their future was very uncertain,being from a small company. They didn’t have the fans or the attention a group debuting from one of the BIG3 has even pre-debut. They did slowly and painstakingly build their fandom from scratch.
But they also did have some opportunities. They had good producers and choreographers,a boss who they are on good terms with,chances to perform. All the creative talent at BH who did their best to give them songs and concepts that allowed them to shine and capture the attention of fans. They had a team that actually cared about the message of the songs,which is more than half the kpop groups have,even the ones from big companies. They had a media-savvy team which capitalized on their individual and group charms. They each were lucky to have teammates they ended up having amazing synergy with. They were lucky to have Namjoon as a leader. Also,they are men. A girl group might have had a very different story,even under BH.
Knowing that doesn't make me me feel manipulated at all. I'm also extremely lucky they had these opportunities,because I can be a fan of them now and enjoy their music and content. Also,I think while the fact that they struggled is real,using the underdog story to flex in front of fans of other groups is half Army's doing. No need for BH,we can manipulate ourselves lol. Like with BE as the 'entirely-self produced' album. BTS say one thing,and Army go lachimolala with it. BTS straight up say they are not living together(Namjoon's "Yes,we are all living at the same time" answer.),but people still choose to ignore that.
During their first years I have no doubt that it was hard for them and they weren't rich by any means,but they personally never milk their own experiences for sympathy. If you once lived in a small apartment with six other people,and weren’t sure your efforts will be rewarded,and then got super rich,of course you’re going to compare your current experience with your past one. Like,wow,do you remember those times. Wow,we can't believe we got here from where we were. They are allowed to reminisce and be surprised by their own success.
But there is other stuff that might make me feel cheated if it happened: -They aren’t the ones who post on their weverse/twitter(someone else might..)
-The scripts for all the run episodes and even lives are so tight there is no room for them being themselves. We know they have scripts,but I think they’re mostly guidelines?
-if BH pushes fanservice for them in their 8th year (not Jikook,but I sometimes feel like that with Yoonmin. Like,the company knows they are a ship and they have to interact on-camera to keep the fans happy)
-Diets. Do I want to know? Jimin recently said he didn't eat for 5 days so he won't have any fat on his face in the Butter MV...Is this mandated by the company?
-No freedom AT ALL. Yes,they’re shareholders,but they are also under a contract,and we don’t know what that contract entails.
- If they secretly hate their own songs/hate Army (not very likely)
Basically I would feel manipulated if it turned out their working conditions were worse than we expect,or if the whole foundation of who they are was fake. But I actually like that they aren’t trying hard to sell the recent content,when they look bored or when Namjoon is passive-aggressive in interviews. It allows me to know what they are really thinking. Maybe?
I’ve always wondered if people realise how Hybe (I won’t say BTS but …) is manipulative in the content they release to keep fans engaged almost 24/7. Because they are! Obviously every brand can be manipulative to a certain extent. We are customers and they need to make money 😅 but some people really do seem naive. I don’t know if it’s because I’m a bit older than the average demographic and work in Marketing but yeah - sometimes it irks me the wrong yeah. I don’t want to start drama on your blog so no need to post this if you don’t want to 😉
Hi @lololypopy ! Thanks for the Ask. And it's okay; if someone wants to start drama that's on them. We're gonna have a mature discussion.
These days, many people view marketing as manipulative because marketing is about persuading consumers they need whatever what the brand is selling: a service or a product. But many times brands are really selling ideas and values, too, and this is the case with Hybe, BH and BTS. [Hybe is the parent company, while BH is the record label and the specific brand (end product) is BTS.]
INSEAD says that marketing should be influencing not manipulation. They want marketers to make this distinction more clear, too. Manipulation for them is the use of deception or underhanded tactics to influence consumer behavior instead of using facts. Basically, if a consumer wouldn't choose a brand if they knew the truth about important aspects of the product or brand, then that is manipulation in marketing. A prime example is when Volkswagen fooled its customers into thinking its cars were more green than they were. That level of deception is also criminal.
The reason people find BH's marketing tactics manipulative is because of the false reality and social media addiction they create through their content. Content is delivered near-daily, and sometimes several times per day. This creates constant engagement, addiction and reliance on the brand as part of their consumer's daily lives. The normal and healthy boundaries between brand/consumer and artist/fan are blurred. Participation in activities related to the band becomes almost compulsive (hello, here we all are on Tumblr... lol).
It also heightens an already intense para-social relationship between consumer and brand, where the consumer becomes an object of love and appreciation of the brand ideologically (such as MOA or ARMY), which intensifies brand loyalty. There is a false sense of reciprocation there, and it is driven further through certain narratives. Being labelled as ARMY strips consumers of their identity, too. We become an unknowable collective instead of indivudals withour own needs and values. This is rather cultish, but that's a post for a different day. :D
In this type of setup, fans are made to believe they must act to defend the brand and help the brand achieve its vision. The brand's vision becomes the consumer's vision, which is genius or diabolical, depending on how you look at it.
A lot of people believe that the marketing narrative of BTS in particular was constructed well before their debut. They were setup to be the loveable underdogs that would appeal to a western market where a rags to riches story is universally loved. Do I believe this? Honestly, I don't know because it seems slightly over the top and maniacal. Like, a little too Hank Scorpio to me. But there are a couple things that leave me wondering.
One of the interesting facets of this argument is that I haven't come across any hardships BTS faced that other groups didn't also face. Their company being new and the group not being taken seriously is par for the course and lots of other groups have been through the same and were not successful. Being cut from a show at the last minute is also routine in show business. However, I imagine there are things I don't know about, so feel free to share what you know in the comments but please do so respectfully. This is an adult discussion, not fan wars, etc.
Another reason that this strategy could have been in place from the get-go is because it seems to still be in place despite incredible success. The underdog narrative is difficult to sustain in the face of success, which is perhaps ironic. Conan O'Brien is probably a great example of this. His schtick on Late Night was based around being the underdog with the low budget and the bad/weird ideas. This did not translate well to The Tonight Show, nor did any attempt to retool his persona/schtick.
Recently, there was gratitude expressed by BTS for the protection that ARMY gave the group. Personally, I'm uncomfortable with this because it furthers an unhealthy para-social realtionship that is truly unbalanced. It creates a drive for recommitment to fan labor (streaming, posting, reporting, etc), which of course the group relies on for their outstanding numbers when it comes to views, likes, streams, and ultimately record sales. It was RM who made the comment, and I was really surprised to hear it. And, as ever, it's about the way things are said. Fans should be encouraged to speak out against racism and other prejudice the group ecounters, but the idea that there is a specific protection that only the fans can give is disingenous because the vagueness of the comment can be misinterpreted to support the wealth of fan labour. Basically, it furthers radical commitment to the brand.
Now, don't come at me in the comments because I haven't said I believe this theory. It is one perspective and I do think it has valid points, but that doesn't mean it's true. Circling back to the heart of our topic, this is what I would ask: If you found out any of the following were true, how would you feel about the brand BTS? Would you still feel like supporting it, or would you feel lied to or otherwise deceived? (Keep in mind that I'm not saying these things are true AT ALL; this is a thinking exercise. Got it?)
none of the group live together (you could argue this lie provides privacy but it also creates a false reality)
they aren't all great friends
there were no hardships faced by the group that others of the same or previous generations didn't also face
they had plenty of food and ate out often, even during pre-debut (this is an interesting one because many ARMY circulate the idea that they could barely afford to live)
all of the money challenges in reality and variety programmes that made it seem like someone wouldn't eat or otherwise would suffer were fake (this is 99% likely, btw)
the group actually had opportunities that others didn't
the group has had an autonomy and freedom that other groups have never had, giving rise to more opportunities
Share your thoughts! Do you think BH and Hybe market their brands ethically? Do you ever feel manipulated? Why or why not?
Hello!!
This is regarding the question which you answered about Hybe’s brand reputation and it got me thinking a little bit. Firstly, thank you for sharing your views!
When you talk about the underdog thing, it is something that i used to give a lot of thought about. I’ll be completely honest and say that the reason i was even attracted to bts’s music (back in the WINGS era) was because they were not promoted by a big company. To see them win their first daesang then was really cool and a proud moment- and thats on my genuineness. However, as you said bts are not the only ones who have had a rougher past in the entertainment industry. But i would argue that even their earlier albums did break some records and they were received well as a rookie group. So this sudden rise in popularity? I would say that luck had a BIG role to play. I wouldnt go as far to consider all their hardships a lie or an overtly made fantasy to garner fans (consider mamamoo as an example because they are very much respected in SK even tho being from a smaller company). At this point we could also consider the sagaeji rumour and the other different fanwars/ pressures from inside the industry itself. Did these actions create an averseness to the groups who were involved in it? That can also be taken as a contention, ig. Or maybe the SK media wanted to profit off the ‘rising’ stardom of bts- a pretty common thing too.
Next comes the hegemonic relationship of army- and bts. I think, to a certain extent, army as a singular entity is very much required for fighting all the racism and xenophobia that constantly surrounds bts. Being an asian, i can attest to how demeaning people can get. So, to keep the fans as a frontier is actually a very smart business choice- considering the West is pretty much in awe of the sheer vastness if the fandom which doesnt really translate to bts’s musical abilities (again, example, LGO with her 6 radio spins). What RM said, maybe its because of the fact that he knows the sort of foulness that transpires because of the sheer baseless hatred towards bts (like the jm rape thing that happened recently, and many other defamatory statements). But yes i do agree that making the fandom into a cult is not the answer.
But the crux of the hybe/ bh agenda is the fact that they give out a LOT of content. This is absolutely contrary to what happens with blackpink- who has, arguably, the second biggest fandom. Both the companies have really good business tactics but work on opposite ends. But i digress. I admit that i never really saw bts as businessmen, at least not before they explicitly mentioned in the Grammy Museum interview. That was something that kickstarted my thought process on the economics of the group. Obviously, they are working insane hours, its only fair that they get something in return. So thats one of the point i would disagree with you on. Buying material- thats on the fans. A company is here to do business- irrespective of the way it operates. At the very least we dont have an lsm (lol).
Lastly, your point of group dynamics. This is something i do strongly disagree with you on, mainly because, we as spectators have no right to speculate deeply on their relationship. I work on the assumption that all the members, they are friends. They talk about each other, they care about each other, they respect each other, their parents love the other members and whatnot. To completely disregard a relationship to vilify a company is something i do argue against. Secondly, being in close quarters, its natural that people argue and fight, so something like that again, holds no base in saying that they are not good friends.
-im sorry for the really long ask (😅), i understand its pretty ambiguous. but i love reading thru the answers on your blog so i’s be glad if you could give some opinions on this too!!!
Hi @crystal-lining ! Thanks so much for sharing your thoughts. There is a lot to unpack here and I think the readers will really enjoy reading your perspectives.
And, I don't think you're disagreeing with me re: group dynamics. I don't believe that—which I stated in the post; it was a thought exercise. Basically, if you were to find out the group wasn't as close, would it change your feelings on the brand? It's an interesting question to me.
None of this post is meant to vilify anyone. It's a discussion of marketing practices. Lots of companies skirt the lines of manipulation in marketing. The post I made is not BH = evil. Rather, I wanted to bring up ideas and perspectives that are usually ignored.
It's interesting what you say about BTS as businessmen because I think most of them are pursuing MBAs at the moment. That really shows their commitment to strengthening their activities in the business side of BH/Hybe.
There’s been something weighing on my mind lately, and I feel like I should share it. As of late, there has been a lot of talk surrounding BTS’s music, their choices, and their path for their future. It was shocking to see how just 3 songs meant for the American/Global market could create such a sardonic rift within ARMY. Although I do agree that not every ARMY has to enjoy “Dynamite,” “Butter,” and “Permission to Dance,” I do believe that some things are being overlooked in regards to BTS’s ambitious plan to win a Grammy.
One of the first things I have noticed is that K-ARMY and I-ARMY reacted differently to the success of these 3 songs. Korea has been so proud of BTS, even sharing online how much they cried to see the boys top the Billboard Hot 100 again and again. They even trended on twitter multiple times their thanks to American ARMY, expressing their genuine gratitude for how hard the American fans are pushing for the boys’ success in the US. What I-ARMY is choosing to ignore is how much this means to K-ARMY, let alone Korea as a whole.
It has dawned on me why I-ARMY, predominantly those from America, Canada, and the UK, don’t understand the push for BTS to make a stake in the American music industry, and ultimately a Grammy win. The reason is quite simple. To those I-ARMY from America, Canada, and the UK, you must realize that the American market and the Grammys have always, ALWAYS, been accessible to your artists. The biggest names in music history have won Grammys, but only because they all fit into the pretty box of European features and English lyrics. They didn’t have to try to fit a mold. They didn’t have to break into the market. They just walked right in, practically invited with the door wide open. It really wasn’t until recent years that even African American artists were winning the biggest awards of the ceremony.
This is a MUCH bigger deal to Korean and Asian fans than it would be for western fans. I don’t think others realize how much this means to us. People like us have been marginalized forever, and given little to no respect or recognition by the American market, let alone the Grammys. To Koreans, having one of our own be able to come as far as BTS, is truly inspiring and makes us feel validated in a way we’ve never felt. The American market and the Grammys may not seem like a big deal to you guys, but for our people, this means the world. We feel proud. We feel accepted. We feel we finally have a place at the table. The Grammys may not seem to be worth much to you, but to Korean and Asian artists, it is the very pinnacle of recognition and respect in the music industry. This award has eluded our people for as long as it’s been handed out, and now there is hope. There is a chance. BTS is Korea’s pride for a reason. They’ve changed so much already for us. We hope for their success. Their success is OUR success. The respect they receive brings pride in our culture and our identity as Koreans, as Asians. It is more than you could ever imagine.
It breaks my heart how little people regard K-ARMY and Korea’s reaction to all of what BTS has achieved in America when forming their opinions on BTS’s quest to be regarded as worthy artists for the biggest award in music history. You don’t have to like their English songs. You don’t have to like their approach. But just understand it’s not easy for them as a Korean boy band to be taken seriously. If these boys could, they would write their own English songs. But they can’t. It’s not as easy as you would think. Especially for rap line. The songs they are given are appreciated by BTS, and they are thankful for those who help them in a different language for a very different market. They’re saving their lyricism where they can get their full heart and message across – The Korean market. Meant for THEIR people, in THEIR language. If you are unhappy with the American singles, just hold on and believe in the boys. They know what they’re doing.
For Korea, their dreams are OUR dreams.
I’ve always wondered if people realise how Hybe (I won’t say BTS but …) is manipulative in the content they release to keep fans engaged almost 24/7. Because they are! Obviously every brand can be manipulative to a certain extent. We are customers and they need to make money 😅 but some people really do seem naive. I don’t know if it’s because I’m a bit older than the average demographic and work in Marketing but yeah - sometimes it irks me the wrong yeah. I don’t want to start drama on your blog so no need to post this if you don’t want to 😉
Hi @lololypopy ! Thanks for the Ask. And it's okay; if someone wants to start drama that's on them. We're gonna have a mature discussion.
These days, many people view marketing as manipulative because marketing is about persuading consumers they need whatever what the brand is selling: a service or a product. But many times brands are really selling ideas and values, too, and this is the case with Hybe, BH and BTS. [Hybe is the parent company, while BH is the record label and the specific brand (end product) is BTS.]
INSEAD says that marketing should be influencing not manipulation. They want marketers to make this distinction more clear, too. Manipulation for them is the use of deception or underhanded tactics to influence consumer behavior instead of using facts. Basically, if a consumer wouldn't choose a brand if they knew the truth about important aspects of the product or brand, then that is manipulation in marketing. A prime example is when Volkswagen fooled its customers into thinking its cars were more green than they were. That level of deception is also criminal.
The reason people find BH's marketing tactics manipulative is because of the false reality and social media addiction they create through their content. Content is delivered near-daily, and sometimes several times per day. This creates constant engagement, addiction and reliance on the brand as part of their consumer's daily lives. The normal and healthy boundaries between brand/consumer and artist/fan are blurred. Participation in activities related to the band becomes almost compulsive (hello, here we all are on Tumblr... lol).
It also heightens an already intense para-social relationship between consumer and brand, where the consumer becomes an object of love and appreciation of the brand ideologically (such as MOA or ARMY), which intensifies brand loyalty. There is a false sense of reciprocation there, and it is driven further through certain narratives. Being labelled as ARMY strips consumers of their identity, too. We become an unknowable collective instead of indivudals withour own needs and values. This is rather cultish, but that's a post for a different day. :D
In this type of setup, fans are made to believe they must act to defend the brand and help the brand achieve its vision. The brand's vision becomes the consumer's vision, which is genius or diabolical, depending on how you look at it.
A lot of people believe that the marketing narrative of BTS in particular was constructed well before their debut. They were setup to be the loveable underdogs that would appeal to a western market where a rags to riches story is universally loved. Do I believe this? Honestly, I don't know because it seems slightly over the top and maniacal. Like, a little too Hank Scorpio to me. But there are a couple things that leave me wondering.
One of the interesting facets of this argument is that I haven't come across any hardships BTS faced that other groups didn't also face. Their company being new and the group not being taken seriously is par for the course and lots of other groups have been through the same and were not successful. Being cut from a show at the last minute is also routine in show business. However, I imagine there are things I don't know about, so feel free to share what you know in the comments but please do so respectfully. This is an adult discussion, not fan wars, etc.
Another reason that this strategy could have been in place from the get-go is because it seems to still be in place despite incredible success. The underdog narrative is difficult to sustain in the face of success, which is perhaps ironic. Conan O'Brien is probably a great example of this. His schtick on Late Night was based around being the underdog with the low budget and the bad/weird ideas. This did not translate well to The Tonight Show, nor did any attempt to retool his persona/schtick.
Recently, there was gratitude expressed by BTS for the protection that ARMY gave the group. Personally, I'm uncomfortable with this because it furthers an unhealthy para-social realtionship that is truly unbalanced. It creates a drive for recommitment to fan labor (streaming, posting, reporting, etc), which of course the group relies on for their outstanding numbers when it comes to views, likes, streams, and ultimately record sales. It was RM who made the comment, and I was really surprised to hear it. And, as ever, it's about the way things are said. Fans should be encouraged to speak out against racism and other prejudice the group ecounters, but the idea that there is a specific protection that only the fans can give is disingenous because the vagueness of the comment can be misinterpreted to support the wealth of fan labour. Basically, it furthers radical commitment to the brand.
Now, don't come at me in the comments because I haven't said I believe this theory. It is one perspective and I do think it has valid points, but that doesn't mean it's true. Circling back to the heart of our topic, this is what I would ask: If you found out any of the following were true, how would you feel about the brand BTS? Would you still feel like supporting it, or would you feel lied to or otherwise deceived? (Keep in mind that I'm not saying these things are true AT ALL; this is a thinking exercise. Got it?)
none of the group live together (you could argue this lie provides privacy but it also creates a false reality)
they aren't all great friends
there were no hardships faced by the group that others of the same or previous generations didn't also face
they had plenty of food and ate out often, even during pre-debut (this is an interesting one because many ARMY circulate the idea that they could barely afford to live)
all of the money challenges in reality and variety programmes that made it seem like someone wouldn't eat or otherwise would suffer were fake (this is 99% likely, btw)
the group actually had opportunities that others didn't
the group has had an autonomy and freedom that other groups have never had, giving rise to more opportunities
Share your thoughts! Do you think BH and Hybe market their brands ethically? Do you ever feel manipulated? Why or why not?
I really like how you describe his possible motivations about talking about being with JK the billboard night and the other moments. I also think it’s a mix between bragging affectionately and him just sharing happy memories featuring the people he cares about. It was one of the first things that drew me to him. How friendly he is and how he just wants to show you everything. It’s hard for me to guess what he’s aware of and what not,though,because I can’t even imagine the experience of growing up or living in the spotlight. He’s very smart and aware of his persona,but I also think he’s sometimes just blurting things out because he needs to,and because he trusts army too much.
When I think of Jimin talking about Jungkook or any of the other members,this video always comes to mind. Like,sharing ‘dirt’ on BTS is one of his love languages to army lol. He’s coming to you with an offering of small Bangtan secrets like Bam brings toys to JK lol.
But when it comes to him being pranked by the others,I also think his public persona is softer than he might be irl. So,idk how to say this without insulting him,because it’s not an insult,but maybe he has more of an ego than it’s visible and all the teasing is welcome because it keeps him balanced? Like,Jin shooting smoke is just Jin on any given day,and I really think he would have done it to JK or j-hope the same,but Namgi’s “get yourself together” comments,for example,annoyed me(just indulge his theater kid whims? you guys are no fun. tae would have picked up on that heart skit lol). Jimin seemed fine,tho,so between themselves I think they know better what each of them needs.
BTS roast each other all the time and yet I’ve rarely seen them cross the line into actual cruelty,which is pretty incredible for a group of seven guys. So I don’t really worry about one of them not being treated fairly by the others. That being said,Jimin does get teased more than the others. I wonder if it’s not also because he’s in the middle,age-wise? Hoseok also gets pranked a lot,as the other middle child in this family lol. But he’s more affected by it than Jimin so they don’t do it as often.
I don’t agree at all about JK appearing cold or dismissive,but that’s a whole other topic.
I really really hope they don’t know about all the ship discourse. Not in detail and not about all the hate thrown at Jimin. If they did,would they act differently? I don’t think JK would ever say something,it’s just not his style,he doesn’t like conflicts and he never berated army for the 2019 “scandal” and that affected his friend. Maybe 2021 JK with his “people who don’t like me gtfo” attitude would react differently though. But the army they see might not be the same army we see. Or maybe they think the same as Yoongi,when he said that he knows some army would react reasonably to any dating news. I don’t think they should worry about making sense to any narrative. JK saying he just comes to JM’s room because it’s closer is in character for him. If he doesn’t worry about how it might look like for Jimin,it means they most likely don’t know the extent to which every single one of their words is weighed and counted as ship evidence. I hope they never know.
What do you think Jimin's motivations are for 'exposing' JK's visits IF JK has a bit of a resistance to broadcasting his habits? (maybe resistance is too strong a word but either way I refer to that part of him that requires him to provide an 'excuse' for coming so often)
I am Jimin biased, love JK and am inclined to see them as possibly a couple. I just thought I would get it out of the way because it makes me less objective. The 'Jimin has next to no ego' idea is interesting and new for me. I always thought there was an understandable and human level of push pull / ego protection in all these boys. They are young and have lived in extreme spotlight. I know we are all in danger of projecting our own experiences of relationships, family dynamics, spouse and parental dispositions etc onto the little bit of interaction we see out of Jikook so I almost never speculate in public. It feels kind of like gossiping but I should get over myself. We creatively infer and sometimes it could be right or not. What you said about JK excusing his presence in Jimin's room struck me too. The fact that Vmin would tease him like that is also interesting. My base instict is that their awareness of twitter narrative of aloof/distant JK vs clingy, fawning JM informed the conversation. But I also think my instinct is product of overthinking and projection. I don't think Vminkook think as much about ship discourse as we do. Do you have any ideas about this? Sorry this is long and all over the place.
Maybe it will be clearer if first I clarify that "ego" in my language is used to talk about people who aren't proud or too full of themselves and they're not shy about complimenting other people and stuff like that.
There's definitely a level of ego protection in all of them, but I've always seen Jimin as the most "vulnerable" one. It's not because he cries in front of people but it's about the way he's always talked about his insecurities with so much sincerity and in detail. Like you said, they are young and have lived and still kinda live in extreme spotlight, but I've always felt Jimin publicly talks (to Army, I mean) about himself and his feelings in the same way any of us would talk to their closest friend. The way he's always been so open about his affection with JK on cameras even when JK seemed to be cold or dismissive of those attentions is one reason why I think that, too. I know any man would've not asked twice and the moment they felt their "ego" was hurt, they would have stopped trying. Personally if my friend kept saying I was ugly in front of everyone I would not have talked to her for months lmao but Jimin just laughed and didn't let that change his relationship with JK. I've seen Taehyung feeling offended, pouting and sulking in front of the cameras just because the members laughed at what he said or stuff like that. Just last night during the concert Jin knocked JM to the ground with that smoke gun machine and just kept throwing smoke to JM's face and JK sort of joined too. Your personal opinion, do you think Jin would've done that to any other member? I don't think he would have. He blew a bit of smoke to Tae and that was it. I've talked about this before but to me, it's because of this ego is that JM has always been the easiest to prank. Even in memories 2020 Jimin asked Taehyung "why are you so mean to me?" and Taehyung said "because you're the easiest". And this is not 2014 anymore, but it's still easy for them to act with him in the same ways. I'm not victimizing Jimin, btw I honestly think he doesn't really care and 'overcomes' those situations more easily than I would at least lmao. I really don't do well with other people "joking" about me and I know I would've gotten tired of it real quick if it was done in front of cameras, so it's always been surprising to me that Jimin never seemed too affected by it.
As for him "exposing" JK's visits, if I had to say there was any motivation to it, I would say that it's because he wants people to know that fact about his relationship with JK. It's not that he wants people to know that about JK himself but in a way of "this is what our relationship is like, this is what he's like when he's with me and it's a daily thing for us".
I also think a lot of times he kinda sounds like he’s bragging that he gets to have those moments with Jungkook. He looked like he was having the time of his life when he was talking about JK coming to his room, in the sense that he seemed really flattered by JK visiting him so often.
Besides that, I'm not sure tho if there are any actual ulterior motives for him to talk about that stuff. I think he's just really REALLYYY fond of those moments. I think him talking about it comes from a place of affection. And then there's stuff he just seems to think it would be fun to tell too, like when he talks about JK snoring or how he sleeps with his mouth open. When in ITS he said he never knows when JK is sleeping until he suddenly hears him snoring, the way Jimin talked about it, it just screamed affection to me.
He's talked before about how the people in his life are the most important thing for him and it makes sense that he would talk about them too, because talking has always seemed to be one of the ways in which he shows affection. At the start of 2020, when Jimin said that the thing he enjoyed the most was waking up and seeing Jungkook, I told someone how Jimin seems just so incredibly proud of the relationship he has with JK, whatever that relationship might be. A while after, he said this and it's one of my favorite things he's ever said.
I don't think tho that it's something that actually bothers JK or anything, because I think that if it did, he could talk to Jimin about it and ask him to not say stuff like that, or to consult with him first in my opinion.
For billboard #1 when he said he was with JK, in the live he raised his hand and smiled and said "I told him the news" meaning he told JK about the #1. I don't think either that his intention was to make any statement on what type of relationship he has with JK, but that it was an incredible memory for him that I know he cherishes infinitely. I think he was just happy about that night, and that trying to talk about it without mentioning JK would be too difficult, because it was an experience he had with JK alone. I don't think JM talks about this stuff as a way to expose their romantic relationship or because he's seeking out validation from strangers. It's just him living his life and living his friendships/relationships the same way anyone of us would.
How does he decides what to share and what not to share? That's something only he knows. Because there's definitely so many more ocassions that he's spent with Jungkook that he's never talked about.
As for fandom narratives, me too sometimes my first instict is to think "they're doing this or that because they know" but honestly I don't think either that they care that much about ship stuff. Do they know something? Yeah of course they do. But how much do they know? If they know EVERYTHING or as much as we do, then I'd have to say that I would be kind of really disappointed in them, because this ship stuff has gone way too far for some people (I'm including myself as one of the people for whom it has gone too far) and if we assume they know absolutely everything then we would have to talk about them purposefully doing stuff that's brought up so much hate within the fandom, especially for Jimin.
It’s interesting though that some people say they’re showing a more free,less idol-like image due to all those changes you mentioned while others think their brand is now getting aimed at a younger audience,and that they’re playing it too safe now,based on their last releases. I don’t know what to think.Their image is changing,that’s for sure.
To be honest,after this concert I felt that the past year’s changes in musical direction weren’t as harmless and insignificant as people said they were,and that’s something I,eh,have a lot of conflicting emotions about. I felt the the reactions to this concert were already different,to the reactions I used to see in the past,and even compared to MOTS ON:E just a year ago. But maybe I’m wrong about that,I don’t know. I just hope “new era” doesn’t just mean PTD part 2,that’s all I ask.
For me,even if they reinvent themselves,or even go solo someday,there are two big things that me being their fan depends on. First is,if I feel the same way I always did,hearing them sing or watching them perform. And if they’re still close to each other.
But,at least about the second part,watching them flirt with each other 0.1 seconds after they made their accs was reassuring lol. Some things never change,even on a new scary platform that they’re all navigating individually* now. (*jjwan and jwehope said not today)
Really curious about the reason for making these accs now (enlistment isn’t for a year still,but who knows),and tbh I felt that anxiety too. Like,what else will be different now? But BTS seem to be bringing their customary weirdness and honesty (and the 2seok banter) to it,so now I’m also a little excited about what kind of content they’ll end up sharing. I wasn’t around for their early bts_twt days though,so I’m curious if it looks like a return to that,if someone got to experience both?
It really feels like BTS are rebranding themselves. I don’t think their individual Instagram accounts mean they are going solo (they haven’t expressed any wish whatsoever to do so), but they are making a statement. This year was the first year in their careers that BTS didn’t release an album (a “real” album). This year will also be the first year BTS don’t attend end of the year award shows. It was the year some of the members attended a Hollywood concert and were seen drinking and hanging out with celebs, and the year Jungkook started wearing t-shirts again and got two very visible piercings. Now they got individual IG accounts, and announced an album that will be the beginning of a “new chapter” for them. This new chapter seems to be one of more freedom. They’re shedding the “idol” label imo. Not because they dislike being idols or dislike idols, but because that label is obviously restrictive, and in a way they’ve “outgrown” it. It’s because of the idol label they probably haven’t attended Hollywood after-parties (their busy schedule and the ritual vlives are part of that too) and that they are so careful with everything. It’s not just the idol label that holds them back (HYBE still wants to make bank, and the flack they got when they released an English song was kinda self-inflicted due to the many times they said music transcended language or that their albums would be Korean with a “little” English). Also, they are still Korean, make content for fans, sing in Korean, do plenty of idol stuff. I just think BTS admire American artists and want to have careers and music like their theirs - they can only do that by continuing on this path they’re on.
Anyway…. this IG thing feels weird. I don’t know if it’s because they’re going to enlist soon and this is the beginning of everything changing, or if it’s because they are not enlisting and are ready to become household names in the US and must change their image accordingly… Both? I think they are happy with these changes nonetheless, because they get to reinvent themselves and not be boxed in in their careers and lives. But waking up to BTS getting individual IG accounts felt like waking up in a parallel universe. Their accounts looked like fan edits to me. BTS lately have been surprising me a lot. I’m a bit scared, because they are changing in some way and change is scary…