I've Seen People Hating On Marinette And/or The Writing Of Ephemeral For "doubting Her Feelings For Adrien"

I've seen people hating on Marinette and/or the writing of Ephemeral for "doubting her feelings for Adrien" or like being "grossed out" by him after finding out he was Chat Noir but that's not what it was at all? At least not how I read it. I mean I fully expected and was in fact Looking Forward to the inevitable freakout and prpr Coping Period for Marinette while she had to rethink her entire world. If you didn't think that would happen on her end then idk if you've been paying attention to the show but anyways

Marinette wasn't doubting her feelings for Adrien but rather doubting their Validity, i.e. she was basically going through the True Selves(tm) discourse bullshit in her head - "Was I in love with a fake Adrien? Is Chat Noir the real Adrien and the Adrien I fell for just an act? Or is it the other way around? How could these two people I thought were completely different be the same?" It was only natural that she'd freak out because of how Adrien had compartmentalized different aspects of his personality in to different "masks" and how he always acted overconfident and over the top around Ladybug as Chat Noir. And then as she watched him more closely with this new knowledge, she started seeing how the two sides overlapped and fit together as one wonderful boy and realized they're Both parts of real Adrien, and that the boy she loved was also her partner who had been fighting alongside her all this time, and she loved him all the more for it.

Conversely in the Chat Blanc timeline she'd already been dating Adrien for some time before the reveal so she'd undoubtedly already seen him act like a clown around her, and on the flip side, seen Chat Noir act more Adrien-like around Ladybug since he secretly knew she was his gf, so it would've been easier to put the two of them together in her mind (and a lot of the shock would've been overridden by the intense emotions of the "breakup" that'd just happened). In the canon timeline, Adrien only resolved to act more like himself as Chat Noir in Glaciator 2.0, which was only 7 eps before Ephemeral. On top of that, as you know, those 7 eps had a lot of other important stuff going on in the foreground, leaving little time for Ladynoir to just hang out together and talk one-on-one like they have before. He hasn't had enough time/opportunity to really show who he is to Ladybug, and therefore at the present time Ladybug still has the idea of him being this overconfident flirt/clown - and that's really not her fault.

Was there ever an analysis or theory you have read for a fandom you are in and it is really good but some parts of it are inaccurate/incorrect/incomplete etc. but you press "like" on the whole thing anyway instead of spending time reblogging talking about how you mostly agree with them but then list the small ways you add/correct/disagree with them about their post . . .

*inhale* *exhale*

So now its saved in your "likes" and you just see it as a post you mostly agree with but not fully and you just want to take/remove certain parts of that analysis or theory (or mostly just inject some of your thoughts into a reblog, just adding your take, or at least part of it, on the analysis) but you just don't?

If I had done this I would have had a lot more posts on my page.

Maybe I should just so I could voice some of my thoughts on the matter instead of just letting it bounce around in my head.

Don't want to stay complacent anymore in my regrets and make my thoughts known and speak for myself!

Ephemeral be like

Ochaco smiling a lot and being happy isn't someone she's pretending to be, its just another aspect of her character.

And yes there were times were she had put on a happy face to hide her true feelings.

The character arc of Ochako Uraraka

I think the biggest problem with Ochako was thinking of her feelings as a burden to other people. She just doesn't wants to be a bother to anyone and that's why whatever she has to say or what's going on her mind isn't important to her and she just keeps bottling it all up.

Pretty ironic when you remember the fact that she wants to become a hero who can lift the burden of other people.

I think, it emerges from her own household where her parents worked so hard just to keep food on the table. By the Bonus Material that Horikoshi added it can be seen how far she's willing to go to save money i.e. how far she's willing to go to not be a bother and while wanting to help her parents is a very good thing but going on extreme lengths to do so and then giving birth to a new set of problems definitely isn't.

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Instances of Ochako's bottling up her feelings:

She doesn't even talks about herself. She told Izuku in the Cavalry Battle that it's better to team up with people you're friends with but later revealed that how bad and ashamed she felt for relying on him. The problem here is also that she's too critical of herself. She knows her limits (after her brawl with Bakugo, she knew she lost because she didn't have a back-up plan, in season 5 also she admitted that she should have been a bit more calm) and while that is a good thing, she just overvalued other people way too much.

Even after her battle with Bakugo when Deku comes to check if she's okay, she pretends as if nothing happened and all his worries were for nothing. Because again, it was her loss and she wouldn't want Deku getting bothered by it. So she just puts on a fake cherry smile and wishes Deku luck for his match only for him to overhear her crying in her phonecall with her parents.

She has strong feelings, opinions and motivations but she wouldn't let anyone be bothered by it. She has a side that gets jealous, that is insecure, that is strong willed but she wouldn't let it show.

Another big instance is when she refused to go for the Bakugo Rescue in Kamino. She knows Bakugo well to understand that he wouldn't like receiving help from people he looks down on. She thought too much about what Bakugo would think and it all ended up in vain when Izuku and gang went anyway and saved Bakugo from the LoV. Just like Asui at that time she felt sad and maybe ashamed but she never said anything like that during that time and yet it was brought up again in the recent manga.

Why? Because it was yet another example of her ideology that her opinion is not necessary which is wrong since her take on this matter was damn important!!

Despite her own second thoughts on the matter she suggested how Bakugo who was the victim, would feel about all this and that lead to Deku deciding that it would be Kirishima to offer help.

Her biggest development in the Pro Hero Exam?

Come to think of it, it was one of my least favourite arcs because how less of Ochako it had. Most characters in MHA learn from their mistakes but ever since her battle with Bakugo it felt like Ochako was never making any mistakes and suddenly been reduced to nothing but a love interest. This scene right here is also probably one of the most misunderstood or misinterpreted scene in MHA.

Ochako decides to completely her feelings away for Deku might have been a good thing on the short term basis but if we look at the impact it had on the larger scheme of things, we can see how big the concequences were. She thought that again, her own feelings are very unnecessary and just a burden on Deku and his Hero career and even for herself, so she decides to put it all away but it's just partial as stated by Toga in chapter 288.

"When you keep bottling it all up it only grows on the inside"

Which is true because ever since the pro hero exam it feels like despite not admitting to herself or Deku, her crush has only gotten stronger like seriously Chako, you say that you don't like him and yet to keep that All Might Keychain safe and close for your dear life!

So yeah while it might look like a character development on her part, it was one of the biggest mistakes Ochako has made in the entire series! And she was forced to face the consequences of it when Deku left UA and she couldn't do anything anymore. She was forced to face all of it and finally admitting how much of a dummy he is!

Some moments of realisations

One of my favourite thing about MHA is how realistic the characters are written. Despite Ochako not admitting her feelings much often, she does have her own moments of truth.

Before her brawl with Bakugo she admitted that they were all rivals and she wants to get stronger too.

After the Bakugo Rescue she admits that they were all uneasy.

After Sir Nighteye died, she admits to herself that she wants to save people.

In season 5 she admitted how dangerous hero work is and acknowledged how Deku's power hurts him too.

She has a parallel to Bakugo in a way that goes around announcing his motivations to the whole world while she cannot even admit it to herself. She looks up on other people so much that she doesn't looks at her own strength and while idolizing Deku had its own merits, what about her own capabilities?

After Sports Festival she went to learn some Martial arts because she needed more combat experience.

After the Black whip incident she attaches grappling hooks to her costume which gives her more mobility in air and ability to grab people and things from distances (obviously) giving her much needed ranged moves.

But where is her mastery over Zero Gravity?

Where is her use of her actual power?

Their is a big reason why the name for Toga vs Uraraka 2.0 was "Miss Candid vs Miss Shut away". Toga here is the candid one! She is honest because she has learned it the hard way (during her quirk awakening) that the transformation is only external. She tries telling that to Ochako but well, wrong place, wrong time.

Despite being the more Frank person of the group Ochako is not honest to herself and even Horikoshi has stated in his bonus Material that she has no hidden sides to her *wink* *wink* What's the meaning of this?

Obviously, Ochako has a secret side. A dual personality of some sort, that is not the cherry girl we're used to seeing on regular basis. The one that is insightful, brave and doesn't give a shit about what other people have to say and we finally witness it after the war arc when Deku leaves UA.

Now that is not to say we haven't have seen that side of her in pieces even before the war ended. She has shown her sheer wit and determination in Ocha vs Bakugo.

She shows her thoughtful side in season 5 when she acknowledged how hard it is to be a hero and her philosophy on saving other heroes in need.

We have seen it all in tiny bits and pieces though she herself thinks of them as something insignificant, as something not necessary. She just goes along with everyone and never truly admits to the situation because that will lead her to admitting her own flawed thinking.

During the war arc, both her philosophy and her Candidness were put to a test and she was made to face the harsh realities of war. She saw Toga crying, she saw casualties, she saw heroes giving up, she saw the society and the hero system fall apart right infront of her and for someone who originally wanted to do it as a job it was an especially important moment that Ochako had to witness.

And finally her breaking point was when Deku leaves UA. It wasn't the only thing that changed her forever but rather the series of events that followed the events of war but it had to be one of the most shocking ones.

After the kids make an epic return in chapter 319, we see the true side of Ochako Uraraka. The real one that is not faking things just for the sake of keeping the environment tension free. She is still a figure of reassurance for her fellow classmates and family but she is no longer thinking too much about how other people would think, infact she doesn't give a damn!

She is calm, determined and decisive.

She was the major advocate in bringing Izuku back to UA and it just only goes to show how far she has come, both as a hero and as a person.

okay i just genuinely need to know and i'm sorry if it comes across as salty

but why are people so disappointed that the reveal didn't happen and stick for real?

do people really think the characters is ready for a reveal? that the writers are prolonging it for funsies and not because the circumstances aren't right for it?

and do people really want the dynamic to change this drastically? do they not see that when the reveal does stick the show is never going to be the same?

and do they not like seeing all these scenarios? like if i am entirely honest i want to see all these reveals because i feel like once it's done it's done and i will be sad about not seeing any other possible situations and scenarios and confessions and shocks and how the environment/circumstances influence their actions

like i just don't get how people can be disappointed? i loved this reveal, yes, but it was NOT the right time and frankly there are so many other scenarios i want to see and i love getting a chance to explore them in the source material and not just in fanworks

Yes yes yes but like before when I had only watched S1, since we the audience know what LB doesn't see and Adrien isn't the type to be a playboy and a flirt and that he admires Ladybug I always kind of figured he loved her but like yeah I wasn't in the fandom when S2 came around but Glaciator sure was a trip, especially for Marinette, like you talked about.

BRUH I CANT BELIEVE I FORGOT TO POST THIS AAAAH for context i drew these right after optigami came out

recently i've been thinking a lot about the kind of character chat noir presents himself as throughout the show,, been thinking a lot about it now in season 4 (in respect to the role, or should I say, lack of a role, he has in all of season 4 so far)

i rewatched some season one episodes and i was honestly taken aback by how many puns and snarky lines he says in a matter of minutes, and by how blatantly cockey he comes across as fhfjfjgjgg *in evillistrator he says 6 puns in like less than a minute and it gives me psychic damage*

then i was thinking about how much the way we view him,,, the audience as well as ladybug,, changes after his confession and the reality of his genuine love for ladybug (revealed in the origins episodes and glaciator)

i find it absolutely bonkers how much the fanon changed after season 2 was released, as well as watching the origins episodes cause like *BRO IS ACTUALLY GENUINELY IN FUCKING LOVE WITH HER, HES NOT A PLAYER DJFNGNFN*

and then lastly, thinking about him in season 4 (even though we have yet to see him obviously express it) and how abandoned or useless he might feel,, since he hasn't really been blatantly necessary to defeat the akumas and amoks (EVEN THOUGH HE HAS BEEN NECESSARY IN THESE EPISODES ITS JUST NOT OBVIOUS TO THE AUDIENCE AND, BY EXTENSION, HIM)

also i couldn't decide which expression to give chat in this last image so when i asked the syrva discord they suggested i do both. so i made an animation. hdhfhfjjfjffjfjg